Tail of Concorde

[RuudopdeWeegh]

Hello !

A little problem with the Concorde. As you all probably know, the Concorde has an extra wheel at the rear. very often this wheel is very
much needed otherwise the tail would scratch the ground during take off.
Well... whenever this wheel touches the ground FsP thinks the tail scratched the ground. Is there a possibility to avoid this problem
except of course not touching the ground :-)

[SWAFO]

You could always not rotate as much!

[pagir]

Which Concorde are you flying? (And SwaCPT is right: maybe you should not rotate that much...

(Anyway, the problem is not with the rear wheel, it's with the rotate angle exceeding the maximum tolerance set be FsP)

Pagir

[SWAFO]

If you're using a aftermarket concorde, perhaps there's a problem with it and FSP (regarding angles at which tail strikes occur). Just a
thought.

[RuudopdeWeegh]

pagir wrote:
Which Concorde are you flying? (And SwaCPT is right: maybe you should not rotate that much...

(Anyway, the problem is not with the rear wheel, it's with the rotate angle exceeding the maximum tolerance set be FsP)

Pagir

It is the FSFrance (http://www.fsfrance.com) Concorde. I am aware of the rotate angle that confuses FsP but the wheel is there because it is
very much needed also in real life it was needed that much.

You could always not rotate as much!

If the wheel was not needed, it was certainly not built in..

[RuudopdeWeegh]

Did some more Concorde testing and look:
[..]
Pilot's Penalty points: -1097 points (401€ bill)
Forgetting to set the proper flaps during take-off is an extremely dangerous fault and does not show proper piloting skills. (-300)
Forgetting to set the proper flaps during landing is an extremely dangerous fault and does not show proper piloting skills. (-400)
All aircraft are prohibited to exceed 250Kts below 10000 ft AMSL; your speed was 49 Kts above this limit Our company received a fine of
407€. (-149)
Pushing the engines to maximum power with parking brakes set is not a good idea. (-250)
[..]
First... a Concorde doesn't have flaps. only the nose can be moved down- and upwards. With the first test however I so called damged
the flaps by airspeed (?)
Second I did not exceed 200 kts so I wonder about the 250kts
I did not set the parking brakes while starting the enigines. Just to test I put my bird on the runway (offline hihihi) and started the engines
one by one having my thrust on idle

I could take off with 100 passengers but just a little bit of load: fuel 50% and 3000kg cargo; the total load was 44% so this time not
touching ground with "my" rear-end.
If some one needs the particular part of the logfile... from where do I have to copy?? After the line showing "Ending FsPassengers
adventure" ? Then here it si:
[..]
Menu Selected 37660
payload count 7
Payload ini> search loadmodel for: Concorde Virgin Atlantic
Payload ini> Loading : concorde
Payload ini> Loaded: concorde.ini
payload count 7
Payload ini> Zero Cg Pos found: -3.21208
original CGPos= 0.56517
payload count 7
Payload ini> search passenger lon: -68.96 lat:12.19 maxpass: 128
Payload ini> zone nbr: 3 use zone list name (self-1): 3 passengers found 128
payload count 7
[..]

[Overlag]

RuudopdeWeegh wrote:

First... a Concorde doesn't have flaps. only the nose can be moved down- and upwards. With the first test however I so called damged
the flaps by airspeed (?)

well all concorde models ive used still use "flap" as part of the nose movement, therefor if you set the correct nose setting the flaps will
be "down" and FSP will be happy? or did you already do that? And the nose settings also has speed limits, and thats why FSP is
saying "flaps damaged due to airspeed" because the nose is the "flaps" according to FS2004 and FSP

You could also disable it in the FSP options?

[PaulAH]

The tailwheel is only "very much needed" if the pilot over-rotates. Rotate to the inital aittitude of 10 degrees until unstick and thereafter to
theta-2 (around 13.5 degrees for EGLL-KJFK). Concorde will tail-strike (read, hit the tail wheel) at anything over 12.5 degrees nose-up
with main gear still on the ground.

cheers
Paul



Post Edited ( 08-19-05 01:41 )

[DanSteph]

the rear weel is not done so you can tail strike each time. It's STILL an odd event
that you must avoid at any price....

I mean concord wasn't a four weel aircraft....

Dan

[RuudopdeWeegh]

Overlag wrote:

RuudopdeWeegh wrote:

First... a Concorde doesn't have flaps. only the nose can be moved down- and upwards. With the first test however I so called damged
the flaps by airspeed (?)

well all concorde models ive used still use "flap" as part of the nose movement, therefor if you set the correct nose setting the
flaps will
be "down" and FSP will be happy? or did you already do that? And the nose settings also has speed limits, and thats why FSP
is
saying "flaps damaged due to airspeed" because the nose is the "flaps" according to FS2004 and FSP

You could also disable it in the FSP options?

Yes I turned the nose down and immediately after take off, I retracted this nose. before landing with a speed of approx 170 kts I turned the
nose down again.
Only if really necessary I will disble this function with Concorde only.
Nice weekend!!!

[olseric]

all concorde models ive used still use "flap" as part of the nose movement

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but when FS9 was written, I thought that the concorde nose movements were now handled as
a seperate feature (i.e. stand-alone key assignments and internal codes) from the flaps?

[PaulAH]

DanSteph wrote:
the rear weel is not done so you can tail strike each time. It's STILL an odd event
that you must avoid at any price....

I mean concord wasn't a four weel aircraft....

Dan

Clearly you need to buy the Altitude Concorde Dan and forget the other fischer price attempts.

[lacaze]

Hi all,
Sorry about that but I have another problem with the Concorde of FSfrance.
At FL500 and at Mach 2, all the features ofFSP are deactivated.
I mean, the FSP box is still there but I can't feed or play a movie.
In addition to that the FSP menu dissapeares, o I can't stop the flight.
If anybody has an idea, thanks a lot
See ya
++

[SWAFO]

Don't know why you're having the FSP issue, it should work fine at that speed and altitude. Perhaps Dan can comment on this. Maybe
it's not designed to operate at that high of an altitude and speed. I'm really not sure.

About the tail wheel of the Concorde: From my understanding, it serves the same purpose that many of the tail-skid guards on modern
jetliners do today. It's simply to prevent damage to the fuselage from over-rotation. So, technically you should never be "leaning" on this
wheel in the first place.

[Fritz Bayerlein]

As for the ATC and exceeding 250kts below 10000ft, historically the Concorde is exempt from these rules, especially when descending,
because the plane simply can not be slowed down safely to that speed in its descent. The plane needs speed, from takeoff to
touchdown.

I'm sure FS9 doesn't reflect this, nor does FSP. Solution, disable that penaty in more_options.cfg when flying Concorde.