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+--- Thread: Sorry excuse for ATC (/showthread.php?tid=1354)
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Sorry excuse for ATC - bdlong - 08-11-2005
There I am, minding my own business, short final - 500 feet AGL, following direction from the tower who just cleared me to land on 5L. A few seconds
later tower also clears a 737 for 5L. I'm on autopilot for the approach, so I quickly switch to the external view, look back, 737 .2 miles behind
me, (yes, that close), same altitude:
Flight JA271 End of flight report Date November 08 2005
Flight ID: JA271
Pilot: Dean
Company: West2
Aircraft: Cessna 208 Caravan Amphibian WWA
Flight Date: November 08 2005
Departure: 18h17 (23h18 GMT)
Arrival: --
From: KJFK - John F Kennedy Intl - Usa
To: ----
Nbr of Passengers: 5
Accident Report:
The aircraft collided with another aircraft at 20h55 with a speed of 103 kt.
There were no known failures on this aircraft at the time of the accident.The cause of the crash remains unknown, most probably it was due to human
error. No emergency was declared before the crash.
Casualties:
-5 passengers aboard
-1 killed
-2 injured
-Pilot and flight crew were injured
Report:
Flight Distance: 371 Nm Landing Speed: --
Time Airborne: 02h37:46 Landing Touchdown: --
Flight Time (block): 02h38:36 Landing Pitch: --
Time On Ground: 00h01:14 Landing Weight: --
Average Speed: 141.21 kt Total Fuel Used: 870 lbs
Max. Altitude: 16020ft Fuel Not Used: 1286 lbs
Climb Time: 00h18:08 Climb Fuel Used: 123 lbs
Cruise Time: 01h55:05 Cruise Fuel Used: 619 lbs
Average Cruise Speed: 160.51 kt (M0.26) Cruise fuel/hour: 322 lbs (calc)
Descent Time: 00h24:33 Descent Fuel Used: 127 lbs
Passenger Opinion: Terror and grief. (0%)
Crash Financial Report:
Taking into account the state of the aircraft and its current resale value after the crash. The insurance company decided to pay a total of $462,704
which represents 19.66% of the resale value. You can now decide to repair or sell the wreck. The insurance will pay all other damages. The insurance
rate increased by 0.74% and is now 4.97%.
Total Sim Income: $462,704
Company Reputation:
Due to the crash, your company reputation is now: 90% (-8.52 decrease)
Overall Flight Result: Crash
Pilot's Penalty points: -850 points
Crash! The aircraft was destroyed in flight at an altitude of 522ft due to extreme flight conditions. Many lives were lost - your fault. (-850)
ยท (why does the pilot always get blamed - what about ATC????????)
Dean
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - Sovek - 08-11-2005
yeah, I hate that, try and find AI seperation, that should solve the idiots in 737 trying to land in front of you. I was on final to land at KMEM, 3
aircraft were on final at the same time to the same runway. there are 4 seperate runways, why not use them.
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - Dutch64 - 08-11-2005
Some other software you might give a try is "AISmooth", though not 100% it does do a good job seperating some traffic
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - alphaone - 08-11-2005
The best way i've figured out to fix this is use aismooth in combination with self correcting your speed for correct separation (something the atc
would normally give you directions on how to do). If you have a TCAS system you can kinda tell which aircraft are in the pattern for your runway, so
just adjust your speed so you're as equidistant between two aircraft in the pattern as possible. And usually it works.
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - savage - 08-11-2005
Pardon me for saying this...
Should you rather not have called for a missed approach and decided on your own to go-arround? As far as I know, if a pilot feels like a
landing will put the passenger's safety in danger, the PILOT has the final word on whether he wants to continue with the landing or not.
The same goes for take offs as well...
A plane 0.2nm behind you, 500ft... IMHO, that's more than enough time for TOGA and a steap 1500ft climb.... It may have been close, but
still enough to clear your plane from danger.... Just my 2c
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - SAS480 - 08-11-2005
http://www.vatsim.net ... Or before someone else says it; http://www.ivao.org
/Daniel
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - Mud - 08-11-2005
Quote:SAS480 wrote:
http://www.vatsim.net ... Or before someone else says it; http://www.ivao.org
/Daniel
bollocks , not everyone wants to fly online.
if AI aircraft get on me nerves I disable traffic ( nice feature in games ) but I must say AIsmooth works out 90% of conflicts for me.
Mud
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - olseric - 08-11-2005
Another thought, in real life, aicraft into busy airports, which I suspect you were flying into if you departed from JFK, usually are made to
maintain 180 kts or better until the OM. If you're falling way behind that, you're prolly gonna have something creeping up on you.
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - bdlong - 08-11-2005
I was flying to KRDU (Raleigh-Durham International).
I had one 737 enter the final while I was on the "base" leg. Tower had him call ground while I was still 5 miles out, so I knew he wasn't a factor.
I was lined up on the ILS, and had been on it for about 2 minutes before the incident. I'll admit, I could have done something to avoid the accident
- but I didn't for two reasons - one, that close to landing, ATC has always had the 2nd aircraft "go-around". two - I was curios as to what would
happen. In FS9 I had crash turned off, so I was expecting the 737 to fly through my aircraft if he didn't go around. I had my finger in the "print
screen" button so that I could take a snap shot of it.
The report was interesting -
-5 passengers aboard
-1 killed
-2 injured
-Pilot and flight crew were injured
I would have expected all to be killed, and to say that 2 weren't even injured.....At least the Pilot survived -----to face the press and FAA inquiry
I would have liked to have seen the after action report on the 737,
My biggest complaint - over two hours flying time down the drain along with the income for the flight. Oh well, guess I'll give it another try tonight.
Dean
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - SaVas - 08-11-2005
Well, Even though FS9 default ATC does leave some things to be desired, it is still way beyond anything seen so far, and with certain
addons as mentioned above, can help alleviate most issues with it.
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - DanSteph - 08-11-2005
Quote:bdlong wrote:
In FS9 I had crash turned off, so I was expecting the 737 to fly through my aircraft if he didn't go around. I had my finger in the "print
screen" button so that I could take a snap shot of it.
There is a solution from the Mighty FAQ here:
Other aircraft or AI aircraft crash into me, how can I disable that ?
http://www.fspassengers.com/?action=faq&question=7
Dan
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - eazy - 08-11-2005
Quote:bdlong wrote:
My biggest complaint - over two hours flying time down the drain along with the income for the flight. Oh well, guess I'll give it another try
tonight.
Well, last weekend I had two AI crashes on the ramp in a row, seconds before reaching the parking position. Actually the first time I was
already parked (not at the assigned position, though) and decided to wait 2 minutes because I was 5 minutes early. I could even
see the nose of the AI plane that went through mine for a second, before the screen went black and FSP told me I had crashed.
"NOooo, that wasn't ME, it was HIM!!!" - hopeless ...
It took me about an hour and a certain amount of whisky to get over it, then I did the same flight a third time and finished with the
captain's rank
However I wouldn't disable collision detection, just in case it was my own fault. I love being punished (only by FSP, so don't get me wrong)
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - DanSteph - 08-11-2005
Quote:eazy wrote:
However I wouldn't disable collision detection, just in case it was my own fault. I love being punished (only by FSP, so don't get me
wrong)
I'll call the next version of FsP "Mistress Domina" this may
help some to have even more pleasure
Dan
"Dear passengers, the noise you hear coming from cockpit is simply our nice hostess Miss Domina
that have some fun with the captain... hold on your seat belt"
Post Edited ( 11-08-05 22:14 )
Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - Dutch64 - 08-11-2005
Quote:I'll call the next version of FsP "Mistress Domina" this may
help some to have even more pleasure
Dan
"Dear passengers, the noise you hear coming from cockpit is simply our nice hostess Miss Domina
that have some fun with the captain... hold on your seat belt"
I love this man, create some more addons, i can't wait to have my own virtual madhouse here Re: Sorry excuse for ATC - eazy - 08-11-2005
Quote:DanSteph wrote:
"Dear passengers, the noise you hear coming from cockpit is simply our nice hostess Miss Domina
that have some fun with the captain... hold on your seat belt"
Desperately waiting for release !
